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- #: 24505 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 22-Feb-91 19:33:09
- Sb: #bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: Bill Roberson 73320,1550
- To: Ed Flinn 76703,4032 (X)
-
- Ed,
-
- I was checking out my RLE viewing ability and viewed the following file.
-
- The file did not view properly on my screen. I viewed another and it viewed
- properly.
-
- [72376,3650]
- ALLDOG.RLE/graph:rle 15-Jan-90 3864 18
-
- Title : RLE - All Dogs Go to Heaven
- Keywords: RLE CHARLEY ANNE-MARIE ALL DOGS GO TO HEAVEN DON BLUTH JAN1990
-
- RLE picture of Charley and Anne Marie, from the animated movie "All Dogs Go
- To Heaven", A Don Bluth Production. Digitized with Computereyes.
-
-
- Hope the problem was just me, but wanted to make sure you folks knew about it.
-
- 8) Bill 8)
-
-
-
- #: 24507 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 23-Feb-91 05:28:54
- Sb: #24505-#bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037
- To: Bill Roberson 73320,1550 (X)
-
- Dear Bill,
-
- I saw your message to Sysop Ed about the ALLDOG.RLE in our LIBrary 14, so
- I thought I would try it on my EPSON EQUITY I compatible using CompuServe's
- Professional Connection PC3. It displayed fine online for me. Later I will
- try my Commodore C128 in C64-mode and VIDTEX4.2. I'm wondering now if there's
- been a change in the CompuServe software that isn't recognized by your Terminal
- Program. I'm sure Ed will be checking on this too. What program did you use?
- Thanks for bringing this to our attention. Take care.
-
- Sincerely,
- Betty Knight
-
-
-
-
- #: 24509 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 23-Feb-91 08:37:57
- Sb: #24507-#bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: John Iannetta 73510,2152
- To: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037 (X)
-
- Betty,
-
- May I ask a favor of you in an attempt to preserve my dwindling
- sanity? Tell me what you see when you display "ALLDOG.RLE". I tried it in
- normal and reverse video. I rotated the monitor in $5A degree steps through a
- complete circle. Now admittedly, I have not seen the related movie. And I
- don't know what Charley and Anne Marie should look like. But presumably, I
- should recognize the form of life with which I am familiar. The RLE format is
- so unsophisticated and straightforward that it is difficult for me to
- understand how decoders can differ. I realize that the appearance of abstract
- paintings (and cumulus clouds) varies greatly from beholder to beholder. But
- an RLE graphic? Or have I begun to acquire senile macular degeneration?
-
- John
-
-
-
-
- #: 24511 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 23-Feb-91 09:31:50
- Sb: #24509-#bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: Ed Flinn/Sysop 76703,4032
- To: John Iannetta 73510,2152 (X)
-
- John,
- The picture is a girl hugging a dog as another dog looks on, grinning. It
- does seem that some decoders can't handle the file, but I haven't got one that
- fails at hand. GAS64, geoRLE, and Import Runner (the last two GEOS programs)
- have little trouble with it, tho all three show the light/dark values reversed.
- I know the RLE display module for D128 is sensitive to problem files that some
- other decoders seem able to bull thru, but can't test that now, since my 128 is
- down.
-
-
-
-
- #: 24512 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 24-Feb-91 01:36:28
- Sb: #24511-#bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: John Iannetta 73510,2152
- To: Ed Flinn/Sysop 76703,4032 (X)
-
- Ed,
-
- OK, I see the little girl. And I GUESS that it is a dog
- that she is hugging. But I certainly can't discern another dog. However, I am
- sure that I see the technical problem. The file erroneously inserts a carriage
- return ($0D), between the opening escape sequence ($1B,$47,$48) and the start
- of the data ($20,$7F,$20,$7F,...). How the decoder handles this anomaly
- determines the display. Normally, the routine would subtract $20 from the
- byte, write the resultant number of background color pixels, and toggle the
- background/ foreground flag. That would result in a displaced white on black
- image. If the software completely ignores the $0D, as it is less than $20, the
- image will be correctly reproduced. If the program doesn't perform the
- subtraction and clear the ($ED) bits, but toggles the flag, the display will be
- correct except for a negative image.
-
- John
-
-
-
-
- #: 24518 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 25-Feb-91 13:30:14
- Sb: #24512-#bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037
- To: John Iannetta 73510,2152 (X)
-
- Dear John,
-
- Thanks for pointing up the problem of a <Carriage Return> after the
- "<ESC>gh" which sets the High Resolution Mode on in the RLE (Run Length
- Encoded) file ALLDOG.RLE in CBMART's LIBrary 14 that some software could not
- display properly. We're glad you found that problem. After reading your mesage
- I did some random testing of our other RLE files. I used the LIBrary command at
- the Disposition prompt ! read/intel (rea/int) which displays the files in HEX
- Intel format. You can use this command for checking if a file has an Image
- Header, RLE controls, GIF controls, etc. The RLE files I checked did not have
- the <CR> in the Headers.
-
- In CBMART's Graphics Utility LIBrary 10 there are some files which explain
- RLE and some Source code for decoders -- Assembler Language by CBMART's Sysop
- Todd Heimarck (LIB 10 ! bro/key:*rle*). As you know there are various ways to
- program RLE Decoders. Some check for an <ESCape> and bypass the next two
- characters; others check for the <ESC> followed by the "gh". I would imagine
- that most should make sure the data is between 32 and 127 (HEX 20 and HEX 7F)
- which would bypass the <CR> (HEX 0D) problem.
-
- Thanks, John, for your informative message. Take care.
-
- Sincerely,
- Betty Knight
-
- P.S. Malcolm O'Brien uploaded to LIB 14 the file NEWDOG.RLE which has the
- <CR>s removed.
-
-
-
-
- #: 24530 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 26-Feb-91 22:31:16
- Sb: #24518-bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: John Iannetta 73510,2152
- To: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037 (X)
-
- Betty,
-
- I was unaware that CIS honors the rea/int command. I can see
- how useful that would be for checking the first several bytes of a file
- (especially a binary file) on-line. Thanks for the tip. I came across a file
- in LIB 14, "SMPSON.RLE", whose description states that some decoders have
- trouble processing the file. Sure enough, it has a carriage return between the
- escape sequence and the first data byte. Your comment that a decoder should
- make sure that all data are from $20 to $7F is interesting. It lies at the
- heart of the difference between "error checking" and "error correcting"
- techniques. If you receive a $C0, e.g., you know that is an error. But if you
- just ignore it, not only is there a displacement of the rest of the image, but
- the background /foreground flag is not toggled, printing a negative of the
- remaining image. My own choice is to toggle the flag and write a $50, the
- arithmetic mean of all possible values. Similarly, when reading a text file
- with a parity bit, and the RS-232 parity error bit is set, it might be wiser to
- ignore it and print the incorrect character than to skip past it and risk
- shifting a line in a tabular display.
-
- There are also the sophisticated algorithms used in HDTV and military
- radar, which use past data and other information to determine the most likely
- value of a word found to be incorrect. But their use would hardly be warranted
- for displaying a picture of a dog.
-
- John
-
-
-
- #: 24557 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 02-Mar-91 12:21:30
- Sb: #24518-bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: John F. Davis 73455,43
- To: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037 (X)
-
- Betty, I read both ALLDOG.RLE and NEWDOG.RLE with VIDTEX 4.2 They both decoded
- the same. They both looked fine and my Daughter was able to identify the
- picture with no hints.
- (It pays to use Comp-U-Serve software on Comp-U-Serve)
-
- Keep up the good work
-
-
-
- #: 24521 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 25-Feb-91 18:12:18
- Sb: #24507-bad lib 14 file?
- Fm: Bill Roberson 73320,1550
- To: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037 (X)
-
- Betty,
-
- Ed was right when he mentioned Dialogue 128 and RLE.EXT. Glad the file isn't
- completely fouled up.
-
- Wonder if my using Dialogue and RLE.EXT would have any efect on reading weather
- maps?
-
- Thanks for checking the file.
-
- 8) Bill 8)
-
-
-
-
-
- #: 24673 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 20-Mar-91 08:12:15
- Sb: #RLE Dog and Weather
- Fm: Richard Concepcion 72376,3650
- To: Sysop (X)
-
- I've noticed that my file ALLDOG.RLE has been re-as NEWDOG.RLE minus 2
- "offending bytes". I don't recall which RLE encoder I used to create the
- original file that might have produced the problem bytes. However, I do notice
- that when I display the new file with Vidtex 4.2, after the picture completes
- on the screen, Vidtex immediately then Returns To Text without holding the
- picture for viewing. Could one of those original bytes have been there for
- holding the picture on screen until a <CR> is hit to Return To Text?
-
-
- Also, if anyone is interested, CIS seems to have finally fixed the RLE Map
- display options over in WEATHER. Unlike in the "old days" though, RLE Map
- options are now only limited to Depiction (i.e. aviation visibility) and Radar
- (i.e. precipitation). All other Weather forecast options are only available as
- AccuWeather Maps in .GIF format.
-
-
- Richard Concepcion/Rapid T. Rabbit
-
-
-
- #: 24679 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 20-Mar-91 16:56:49
- Sb: #24673-#RLE Dog and Weather
- Fm: John Iannetta 73510,2152
- To: Richard Concepcion 72376,3650 (X)
-
- Richard,
-
- I REAd "NEWDOG.RLE" using VIDTEX V4.2 and the display held,
- until I sent a CR. Ditto with "ALLDOG.RLE". Originally, I found a CHR$(13)
- right after the opening escape sequence. Some decoders did not ignore it, even
- though it was less than CHR$(32), and displayed an aberrant image. VIDTEX DOES
- ignore it and displays the picture properly. Malcolm uploaded "NEWDOG.RLE",
- stating that he stripped "ALL*" of TWO CR's, the other one at the end of the
- file. That has me puzzled, since "ALL*" contains 3864 bytes and "NEW*"
- contains 3863.
-
- Vidtex stays in HI-RES mode until receiving a CHR$(27), CHR$(71),
- CHR$(78) sequence from the host. Sending a CR should elicit that response.
-
- Thanks for the info about the RLE weather maps. I didn't expect CIS to
- support RLE any further.
-
- John
-
-
-
- #: 24700 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 22-Mar-91 16:37:24
- Sb: #24679-RLE Dog and Weather
- Fm: Malcolm O'Brien 76703,4243
- To: John Iannetta 73510,2152 (X)
-
- John (& Richard),
-
- Somebody else said I removed all. I looked at the file in hex byte and found
- that there were 2 CR's. One in the header and one at the end. I have an Amiga
- utility that strips CR's so I removed the two CR's and then concatenated the
- file with a 1-byte file that contained a CR.
-
- So... all that's been removed is the one CR that you had mentioned. Glad to
- hear that it made the file work properly for you. But judging by Richard's
- experience, all RLE readers are not created equal.
-
- Malcolm
-
-
- #: 24680 S14/Pixel Perfect & RLE
- 20-Mar-91 17:36:53
- Sb: #24673-RLE Dog and Weather
- Fm: Sysop/Betty Knight 76703,4037
- To: Richard Concepcion 72376,3650 (X)
-
- Dear Richard,
-
- I've just uploaded to CBMART's LIB 14 the captured messages on these files
- and it is named: RLEERR.THD. I believe you might have missed them. After you
- read the RLEERR.THD I'm sure we all would like to discuss it. I'm glad they
- finally corrected the RLE part of GO MAPS. Thanks and take care.
-
- Sincerely,
- Sysop/Betty Knight
-
-